Hacking?

[lynchmob]

I recently met someone who claimed to be a hacker. SPAMHow broad is the definition of a "hacker" and how far can it go before it is considered illegal? SPAMAppreciate any insight!

[Grinnin Reaper]

My understanding is there are diffrent types. SPAM A broad genralization is the white and black hat hackers. SPAMWhite hat hackers do things against there own systems that they are responsible for to help strengthen their own security. SPAMBlack hat hackers try to go into systems they are not intended to get into to find stuff they are not meant to see or do other things against the proper owners will. SPAMRed hat hackers dabble in Linux (sorry bad joke in reffrence to Red Hat Linux). SPAMI myself like to hack hardware. SPAMI splice stuff around the house into other than inteneded configurations and will naturally grow into the realm of an overclocker as soon as my wallet agrees with my mind. SPAMSo in all honesty it's a broad term to cover many people some that are very honest and work only in the forces of light and then there are those that divert more to the dark side. SPAMLet me know if you have any more questions.

[lynchmob]

THANK YOU!!! SPAMThat was very informative and actually very enlightening!

[thetechfreak]

wot the media classes as 'hacker' is really a cracker

a hacker is some1 who likes to write code (generally a programmer)

it becomes illegal when you access some1 elses property without their permission

white hat: cracks for good reasons, improve security, only with permission

grey hat: for gud reasons, asks for permission after gettin in the system but doesn't mess with it

black hat: bad reasons, will do something malicious

most crackers use linux though, never herd of 'red hat' used before

[JohnDoez]

Hacking is in any form what so ever Illegal, but it is widely used from Police agencies also, I may add, SPAMto control the vast amount of internet sites with Illegal contents etc.

Netangels, has over the last few years recruited Hackers,
To take a look at the inside contents of sites [ due to one major fact that the police do not have permission to ]
mostly porn / terrorists
Then collect the logged E mail addresses etc and pass these onto the CIA.
Now Netangels is a setup where people being stalked etc go to for help, they recruited the Hackerz that defaced certain
O B L [ insert your own swear words about this freak ]
sites after September 11th, these registered members "kind off" have the backing from the CIA.?

A nice piece of information over one grc.com about a 13 year old ( windows user ) using a denial of service attack to remove two T1 servers,but being under age and not causing $5000 the FBI ...
well read it

Cracking, has nothing to do with Hacking, mostly carried out by windows users down loading Programs to stress test Webmasters OWN server, mostly brute force programs to gain User/passowords
Cracking is also considered when you gain those illegal
Crackz to make your downloaded trail version full versions

@thetechfreak: [qoute] most crackers use linux though, never herd of 'red hat' used before . this is funny but not TRUE

Hackers use Linux due to the fact most servers that get hacked are UNIX based, after all the web was designed for UNIX, not as many would think WindowZ.
Also Linux is open source. Therefore all my Programs etc are Legal, I will not get into the Windowz movement any more
But why should SPAMLinux user Crack Seriallz to free software, ?
thats for windowz users

there are many other forms like Phreaking etc.

At the end of the day, it isnt right.

[thetechfreak]

hacking is someone who reads/writes/edits code (as in programming code)

cracking is when you try to get access to a computer you shouldn't be

honestlly i aint ever herd the term 'red hat' before (xcept for the linux distro o course)

linux is widely used for a cracking platform as it has better tools for security (not just keeping it but breaching it)
and also most web services are based on a linux platform (well the decent ones anyway)

[Uranium-235]

*sigh* alright. let me clear this up for everybody


the term "hacker" does not refer to someone who breaks into networks. It just means somebody who tried to figure out how stuff works using any means possible. It's not illegal. I'm techincally a "hacker" cause I try to figure out how comptuers work. now somebody that tried to figure out how other peoples networks work, and use that information to get in...yeah...that part of hacking is illegal

[Blub]

>Hacking is in any form what so ever Illegal, but it is widely >used from Police agencies also, I may add, SPAMto control the >vast amount of internet sites with Illegal contents etc.

How wrong you are, the term hacking implies taking things apart to see how they work, this is illegal? You are talking about the commonly misrepresented cracker.

>Netangels, has over the last few years recruited Hackers,
>To take a look at the inside contents of sites [ due to one >major fact that the police do not have permission to ]
>mostly porn / terrorists
>Then collect the logged E mail addresses etc and pass these >onto the CIA.

This is a recent development and not where the definition of the term originally comes from.

>Now Netangels is a setup where people being stalked etc go >to for help, they recruited the Hackerz that defaced certain
>O B L [ insert your own swear words about this freak ]
>sites after September 11th, these registered members "kind >
>off" have the backing from the CIA.?
You've really only gottten into this recently haven't you, or are you just malking this up as you go along? Security expert since 9/11

>A nice piece of information over one grc.com about a 13 >year old ( windows user ) using a denial of service attack to >remove two T1 servers,but being under age and not causing >$5000 the FBI ...
>well read it

This kid used tools available on the web, he was a script kiddie not a hacker or even a cracker, get your terms right.

>Cracking, has nothing to do with Hacking, mostly carried out >by windows users down loading Programs to stress test >Webmasters OWN server, mostly brute force programs to >gain User/passowords
>Cracking is also considered when you gain those illegal
>Crackz to make your downloaded trail version full versions

STOP THIS HURTS!!! What about John the Ripper a password cracking tool and all the password crackers that run in a nix environment.

>>@thetechfreak: [qoute] most crackers use linux though, >>never herd of 'red hat' used before . this is funny but not >>TRUE

>Hackers use Linux due to the fact most servers that get >hacked are UNIX based, after all the web was designed for >UNIX, not as many would think WindowZ.

Hackers use linux due to the fact that tcpip is originally a unix suite, correct (once in a post aint bad!).

>Also Linux is open source. Therefore all my Programs etc are >Legal, I will not get into the Windowz movement any more
>But why should SPAMLinux user Crack Seriallz to free software, ?
>thats for windowz users

Reverse engineering is a form of hacking cracking is cracking


>there are many other forms like Phreaking etc.

>At the end of the day, it isnt right.

You need to learn before you attemot to talk with authority on the subject now go away and read some material before you comment on hacking and mix it up with all sorts of other things. Mosty linux users would class themselves as hackers due to the fact that they have to fix/ rewrite a lot of crappy open source software which they download, is this illegal???
Is this not right?? Go back to reading the register they will teach you all you need to know muahahaha.

[lynchmob]

I never expected so many responses. SPAMI suppose hacking or cracking or whatever its called is typically understood by most people as a term describing criminal activity. SPAMMy real question is, is just "breaking in" to another's computer or system illegal, or do you actually have to "do" something to it?

[Keefe]

In the past, some hackers who have found holes in certain companies systems and then told them about it have been punished. SPAMThere is a very fine line between snooping and hacking these days.

[Simo]

Ok this is a confusing one but heres what I think the definitions are.

Hacker:
Proper Use: Anyone who writes code
Popular Use: Someone who breaks into banks and steals millions (e.g swordfish)

Cracker:
Proper Use: Someone who illegally gains access to someones computer AND someone who finds holes in software and develops programs to use the software illegally (i.e Keygens)
Popular Use: Mainy the software cracker

[jinx]

Sometimes hacking/cracking may also be used synonymously, as in the linked article. Note the title uses hackers, the third paragraph uses cracked. Hacking may not pay unless you hack up lots of money as this couple did, and then it didn't pay for them.

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/55/23100.html

[Omega]

I'm pretty sure it doesn't take that much to be considered "illegal," unfortunately even if someone does "hack/crack" illegally, the likelyhood of being able to do anything about it is very low.

[Chaz]

According to MIT, hacking is a very broad field which includes anything that must be figured out through complex problem solving and patience (hacked). It can be anything from fixing code to putting a police car on the top of the MIT dome.

Cracking, according to the way I've most commenly heard it (one of these places was MIT also) is anything that involves breaking in through a password or security lock: "Cracking" a system (like you would crack an egg). You can also crack software, much the same way you would crack a system: by trying different password codes or finding a back door to the registration codes. This is sort of illegal if it involves copies of the software not are legally owned, but it's technechally not the cracking itself that is illegal, but the instalation and use of the software. Cracking can be hacking (because it can take problem solving), and when it's not sanctioned, it's illegal.

One of the few times I've turned on the TV in the last three years, I stumbled onto a show about hackers. One of the things that was mentioned is that most hackers are in the trade to alert companies that they have security problems that need fixed. And then there's Microsoft...

A lot of hackers don't get hunted because they aren't really causing any harm, even if they are not allways within the bounds of the law. Then there's the average tech: the totally legal and very necicary hacker. Let's not forget those people who are just trying to improve their own system either. There is even a team of people who work on a contract basis to try and break systems for the producers of the systems as a security test (the military made it five days on one system and it made news in one of my science mags, for an idea of the level these people work at). Of course the only hackers we hear about are the ones that cause damage, which is unfortunate, but logical.

A lot of kids who call themselves hackers use "hacking" programs for both windows and linux. Most of these kids eventually have something happen to them ranging from arrest to a slap in the face from people like the ones my father works with, who send them an e-mail with their ISP, port usage, c drive directory structure, etc. and tell them that if they ever come back out of their corner they better be for real. I've heard of people loosing a system beyond repair to angry sysadmins.

Most of the people who do "real" hacking of the kind we hear about use linux because it's a lot more powerfull than an MS OS. For this reason a Linux Fire Wall can be a burden rather than a boon, because anyone who actually has the skill to hack it definatly will, just for the sake of the available tools (I know this from personal experience of having been hacked). Linux is also closer to UNIX, the original OS (okay, so don't jump on me for that one: UNIX was the most common early mainframe OS, and I'm not claiming any more than that), and therefore the language of the internet. Ping and finger work in MS DOS, but I'm not sure tracerought or anything more complex does. Also, Linux reads UNIX, Linux, Fat16 & Fat32 (MS), and Mac OS file systems. Try reading a Linux file system from Windows without some serious bells and whisltes. It's also more stable, and since the last thing anybodie wants is to have their computer crash and leave them loggind in to the server they just cracked, that aspect holds considerable appeal.

Geeze you guys. Red Hat was a joke. You know, refuring to the Red Hat dist. of linux? It had nothing to do with an _actuall_ classification of hackers. I got it! Lighten up a bit.

PS. According to American Heritage:
hacker (hak??r) noun
1. SPAM SPAM SPAMComputer Science. a. One who is proficient at using or programming a computer; a computer buff. b. One who illegally gains access to or enters another's electronic system to obtain secret information or steal money.

cracker (krak'?r) noun
A person who overcomes the security measures of a computer system and gains unauthorized access. The goal of some crackers is to obtain information illegally from a computer system or use computer resources. However, the goal of the majority is to merely break into the system.

Microsoft Press® Computer and Internet Dictionary © & ? 1997, 1998 Microsoft Corporation. All rights reserved. Portions, The Microsoft Press® Computer Dictionary, 3rd Edition, Copyright © 1998 by Microsoft Press. All rights reserved.

Excerpted from The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, Third Edition Copyright © 1992 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Electronic version licensed from Lernout & Hauspie Speech Products N.V., further reproduction and distribution restricted in accordance with the Copyright Law of the United States. All rights reserved.

Have fun.

[thetechfreak]

this post is still here SPAM :o

wow, this is pretty old lol

that definition post agreed with my post from ages ago before i 'forgot' about this place SPAM:-X

i thought that red hat was a joke SPAM8)

[crawford]

I am a hacker , I have no problem admitting that.

If I access a remote PC using the password they set is that not openenig a door with the key that fits it?
How can you break and enter with a key for the lock , and if you leave without harm then who would have even known you were there.
Comparable to the addage if a tree fell but no one was there to hear it fall - did it really fall?

Knowledge is free - kept by some for profit.

www.thecrawfords.cjb.net --->security section --pass 3233

[xMerCLorDx]

I am a hacker , I have no problem admitting that.

If I access a remote PC using the password they set is that not openenig a door with the key that fits it?
How can you break and enter with a key for the lock , and if you leave without harm then who would have even known you were there.
Comparable to the addage if a tree fell but no one was there to hear it fall - did it really fall?

Knowledge is free - kept by some for profit.

www.thecrawfords.cjb.net --->security section --pass 3233


yeah, but some people have morals :rolleyes:

just making a point ;)

edit: i was browsing your site, some good info, keep it up

thanks for the good review of the site :)

[xMerCLorDx]

no probz

u can always learn more !

[jmarlett]

My understanding is there are diffrent types. SPAM A broad genralization is the white and black hat hackers. SPAMWhite hat hackers do things against there own systems that they are responsible for to help strengthen their own security. SPAMBlack hat hackers try to go into systems they are not intended to get into to find stuff they are not meant to see or do other things against the proper owners will. SPAMRed hat hackers dabble in Linux (sorry bad joke in reffrence to Red Hat Linux). SPAMI myself like to hack hardware. SPAMI splice stuff around the house into other than inteneded configurations and will naturally grow into the realm of an overclocker as soon as my wallet agrees with my mind. SPAMSo in all honesty it's a broad term to cover many people some that are very honest and work only in the forces of light and then there are those that divert more to the dark side. SPAMLet me know if you have any more questions.

Hacking is in any form what so ever Illegal, but it is widely used from Police agencies also, I may add, SPAMto control the vast amount of internet sites with Illegal contents etc.

Netangels, has over the last few years recruited Hackers,
To take a look at the inside contents of sites [ due to one major fact that the police do not have permission to ]
mostly porn / terrorists
Then collect the logged E mail addresses etc and pass these onto the CIA.
Now Netangels is a setup where people being stalked etc go to for help, they recruited the Hackerz that defaced certain
O B L [ insert your own swear words about this freak ]
sites after September 11th, these registered members "kind off" have the backing from the CIA.?

A nice piece of information over one grc.com about a 13 year old ( windows user ) using a denial of service attack to remove two T1 servers,but being under age and not causing $5000 the FBI ...
well read it

Cracking, has nothing to do with Hacking, mostly carried out by windows users down loading Programs to stress test Webmasters OWN server, mostly brute force programs to gain User/passowords
Cracking is also considered when you gain those illegal
Crackz to make your downloaded trail version full versions

@thetechfreak: [qoute] most crackers use linux though, never herd of 'red hat' used before . this is funny but not TRUE

Hackers use Linux due to the fact most servers that get hacked are UNIX based, after all the web was designed for UNIX, not as many would think WindowZ.
Also Linux is open source. Therefore all my Programs etc are Legal, I will not get into the Windowz movement any more
But why should SPAMLinux user Crack Seriallz to free software, ?
thats for windowz users

there are many other forms like Phreaking etc.

At the end of the day, it isnt right.